A Conversation with Gene Logsdon

Chelsea Green

Author Gene Logsdon appears to be picking up steam as he rolls into his ninth decade. He has developed a prolific body of work as a writer, novelist, and journalist on topics ranging from a philosophical look at woodlands (A Sanctuary of Trees) to the higher calling of manure (Holy Shit), and his ever-popular contrarian look at life and farming (The Contrary Farmer).

In his latest book, Gene Everlasting: A Contrary Farmer’s Thoughts on Living Forever, we find Logsdon at the top of his game as he reflects on nature, death, and eternity, always with an eye toward the lessons that farming taught him about life and its mysteries.

We asked Logsdon some questions about his latest book, recurrent themes in the book and whether or not immortality is overrated. Enjoy.

Q1: The subtitle of your book is “thoughts on living forever.” So, after writing the book and thinking about it: Is immortality worth it? Is it overrated?

I wanted to come up with a book sort of making fun of the concept of immortality, one that would be critical of conventional religious views but not showing the kind of atheistic righteousness you see in books by Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens on this topic. I more or less agree with them, but found them a little too angry and strident for the religious believers I grew up and belonged to — too nasty. I used to be angry that way, but I got over it. That kind of approach just makes religious believers all the more convinced that they are right.

But it’s a tough subject to write and talk about without irritating someone. Ideology starts dominating the talk right away. Discussion quickly comes down to ‘my religion versus your religion’ or ‘my lack of religion versus your lack of religion.’ We’re all so filled up with such fear of the unknown about this topic. Even atheists can get religious once in a while, and by that I mean too fervent about their beliefs. As can those who believe that science has all the answers. I have made snide remarks about black holes being quite a stretch and in doing so irritated scientists. I see where the famed scientist, Stephen Hawking, who started the monstrous notion of black holes now says they don’t exist.

To answer your original question, I’ve come to realize that it’s really not worth it — immortality, that is. Ask yourself: What time of your life would you like to immortalize? I know that I don’t want to be immortalized in this winter; this has been the worst damn weather I can remember.

I think even religious people can chuckle about that – what time of life in which you’d like to be immortalized. That kind of mild humor is what really guided me in the writing. I wanted to write about all the Great Notions in a gently mocking way that didn’t irritate people too much — or maybe each side a little bit, both those who believe in science and those who believe in religion. In the end I think I irritated everyone.

Q2: Birds are a recurring animal in the book—killdeer, bluebirds, and even buzzards to which you devote an entire chapter. How come buzzards have such a bad reputation? 

I’m an avid birdwatcher and have been for years, and often in the wintertime I don’t want to go outside and so I watch birds come to the feeder. And we get hundreds of them.

You don’t often see raccoons, coyotes, or wolves, but birds are always around and so I suppose that birds more often sink into my subconscious. But buzzards would anyway— they are the creepiest looking things. Society has demonized buzzards and bats because they look so ugly, but when a buzzard is soaring in the air it’s a very elegant thing. And bats in motion are awesome too.

I describe in the book, the time I saw buzzards circling over the pasture and I knew they had come across a sheep carcass. I sneaked over the hill very slowly so they could only see my head, and there were about 10 of them on the ground wrestling over the carcass, and six of them were on separate fence posts sort of overseeing the carnage. When those six black birds with their red heads saw me they all spread their wings wide, each a six foot span— it was quite a sight. I defy anyone who travels to the farthest regions of the world to find anything more awesome than that, and it was right here close by.

Buzzards are a symbol of death in many cultures and the more I thought about it, the more angles I found to write about—Andrew Wyeth painted them, and a friend of mine and his wife had one as a pet if you can believe it. This is what often happens to me, this kind of serendipity where a subject will become interesting to me in a very tangential way and then feed into my writing.

Q3: You talk about a lot of non-farm topics in the book, the Higgs boson, compound interest and even death cafés. What exactly is a death café and do they serve organic food?

That would make a great article — Menus for a Death Café. Perhaps it should include a bowl of cherries. I’ve never been to one, but as I understand it a group of people get together, drink a little truth serum—alcohol—and tell each other what they really think about dying and death.

The interesting thing I learned about death cafés – or death dinners that people are now holding – is that far from turning people off, the subject makes them perk up their ears. People want to know more.

This is not about ushering off a dying person with a party, although I think that would be a good idea too, but people just hanging out and talking about what they think is going to happen when they die. The point that I think needs to be brought out and what motivated me to write about this topic, and this book, is that younger people are not at all satisfied with what their religions have taught them about death. But there’s a hesitancy to start a conversation about it. When you get a dozen of them together, they feel freer to talk.

If you can bypass traditional ideological mindsets and just talk, then that’s when people begin to open up. That’s also where the humor can come in and that was part of the challenge of this book — writing about death lightly without being flippant.

Q4: People often play the games of whistling past the graveyard or holding their breath when they drive past one. Are cemeteries good for something more than just interring our dead? Should we be viewing, and maybe using them differently?

We’re missing an opportunity to use graveyards for a lot more than just burying people. First of all, we should be viewing them as arboretums and nature preserves rather than just a vacant park. A good place to go bird-watching. Sometimes in old cemeteries you can find native plants that have been all but destroyed elsewhere. Cemeteries can also be gathering places. I’ve read about a cemetery in Washington DC where some of the tombstones are shaped like park benches and people are encouraged to come in and eat picnic lunches there. I think that’s a neat idea.

I like cemeteries. They are so quiet and you are usually allowed to go in them without asking permission.  Why not plant apple trees, pear trees, hickory trees for the express purpose of producing food. People could come in and harvest them and remember that this tree or that tree is growing right over Grandmother’s bones. She made the best pies with these apples. Trees could be grown for the wood too and if all of the cemetery caretakers got together and planned out a schedule for timber harvesting, they could change the places into an ongoing source of lumber  and wouldn’t that would be fantastic. The trees are going to get old and die anyway, so why not use them? Make coffins out of them.

Q5: On a serious note, you write, “There is no such thing as vacant lots or abandoned farms. Nature will always fill them with life.” This is a consistent theme in the book and seems to be a core realization as you came to terms with your own mortality. Why do you think people focus too often on the vacancy rather than what is filled around them?

Nature abhors a vacuum. Yes, this is a very important part of my thinking. There is no such thing as something empty or vacant in nature, and the fact that we tend to look at nature and see emptiness or vacancy is an example of how our education so often is failing us. All around us all the time are marvelous wondrous things happening—like buzzards. We’re so eager to tell people that excitement comes from looking at the Seven Wonders of the World, or to get into an airplane and go far away. It’s just not so and leads to many misunderstandings about nature and reality.  People think that travel will relieve boredom, but boredom is a problem inside the mind, not outside it.

And this idea of there being nothing ever empty was a key inspiration for me because it led me to decide that matter is eternal. There never was nothing. This is where I upset both my religious and scientific friends. To my religious friends, God is eternal, and for scientists every effect must always have a cause. If matter is eternal, they are both wrong.

Deciding that matter was eternal, that the universe in some material form was always going to exist, was electrifying to me because it got rid of all those haunting questions about how life got started. To me the Big Bang theory is as ridiculous as a god hauling off and creating the universe from nothing. When I first thought of this I thought I was brilliant. Or nuts. Then I learned that people have had this thought for thousands of years, and they call it Taoism. That made me feel a little bit better, because I felt that if I’m nuts, then at least I’ve got a lot of good company.

This gets us back to this idea of immortality — that there’s no such thing as an empty place and never will be. Time is only the overflowing NOW. Couldn’t this be the most uplifting notion of all? That the key to immortality lies in mortality? That in nature there is not death but only a change of form.

g ~~



Thank you for your response. I just sent a response to your editor. You can rest assured I am a vocal convert of your writing.

Have a wonderful day. Spring may just get here this week.


I read your latest book “Gene Everlasting”. It was wonderful. I commented on it in your recent “bad hay” blog. Anyway, I did not buy the book from Amazon so I could not review it on their web site. I purchased your last three books from Chelsea directly. I did not see a place to write a review with them. If there is any other place I can write a review I would be more than happy to. Rest assured it would be glowing!

I do have one last comment on your new book. The only thing I might have added was what happens to the family after death, especially when there are auctions of keepsakes, and houses or property sold. I have been through a lot of that lately and it is a very traumatic thing since these material items when sold hit home the mortality of us all. Your book was probably not the place to go into that but I have never seen that type of story told in print. I am sure you have seen this many times at farm auctions.

Keep up the good work. A heart felt thank you for your writing.

    Ken, I used to go to farm auctions regularly, and as you say, I was often filled with melancholy, especially if the owner were still alive and was standing there, watching is life’s work being auctioned off. One of them sat there, weeping throughout the sale. I knew him personally and was overcome with sorrow too. He had some things I wanted to buy but I could not do it. I felt like a vulture. Life ends in sadness and there is no way around it. One of my friends, now 86, says he will never have a sale of his stuff while he is alive. He couldn’t stand it.
    Your kind words about my book are very very much appreciated. As for reviewing, I try not to get involved because it seems so self-promoting. My opinion is that the book publishing business is so hopelessly competitive, the best way to promote a book for minor league writers like myself is word of mouth. May be the best way for anyone. I would bet anything that if you wrote a little review to my publisher and said they could use it, they would find a way. Letters to the editor carry more weight than you might think. But just by posting something on this blog, you have already helped me out, maybe more than either of us can imagine. One never knows. Word of mouth and word of email are probably the best promotion. I have no idea how many people read this blog, but I do know new people continue to comment. I bless them all because together, I think we have a really good thing going here. Gene

Gene, hate to tell you, but the old-timers beat you to it with the cemeteries as arboretums and nature preserves, and the whole take-the-family-on-a-picnic thing.
Mount Hope cemetery in Rochester, N.Y. was the first prototype.
Thanks to a cholera and typhus epidemic in 1834, the city fathers in their wisdom, laid out a rural out-of-town cemetery to help get the dead bodies out of the churchyards. Mount Hope became a magnet for carriage rides and family outings and a daily communing with nature.
Katherine Ashenburg wrote a book about this, The Mourner’s Dance. Might be right up your alley 🙂
If you don’t mind me asking, and it won’t take up too much of your time, how did you decide that matter was eternal?

I agree with you and the hardcore atheists that the body dies and it matters very little what happens to it once the Spirit has left it of course the $64,000 question is what happens to the Spirit or Mind.It’d be a very pointless and sad World indeed in my opinion if the Spirit ceases to exist when the body gives up the Ghost.

Yes, we do not die–only change form! A law of physics…matter cannot be created or destroyed.

Also–I have often found, just as Gene has, that my more bohemian beliefs are more palatable with a heaping dose of humor!

Birds! I have chosen the Mocking bird with its non-com sergeant’s stripes as our family mascot. Scrappy folk who would not stoop to visiting a feeder! but able to blend in to the surroundings for survival and clever enough to learn someone else’s song.

Ah me!



That is just an outstanding interview. I read this article and laughed as I cried. We surely do not talk about this subject that is such a natural part of our world. May you live and write till you are 110!

I just got this book. I will be reading it tonight.

Thanks, Gene, for the observations on life, death and rigid self-righteousness from all corners.
Those comments have been a long time a-comin’!
My old PA Deitsch neighbor, Jake Bolsheiser, echoes your sentiments: “Crazy people are always right. That’s why they’re wrong.”
Been a reader of yours for years.
Keep up the good work, and macht’s gut!

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